I agree 100% with Dr. Belkin's response. It is not surprising that the bottom ranked schools are not the ones pulling out; this is virtue signaling without consequence. Frankly, I went to the school that 1) I could best afford and 2) admitted me. And I ended up being a physician-scientist, even though I went to medical school thinking I wanted to be a primary care doctor...so I probably should have gone to a different school. but it worked out ok.
This is all well and good. I would argue that the majority of people just are going to go where they get it. We are kidding ourselves if we think that the majority of people applying to medical schools are actually using these ranking to decide where they go because the admission process and probably geography and cost decide for them.
The biggest flaw in students and resident today is an inability to take feedback for improvement as a positive. Show me an application process that teaches resiliency and an ability to self reflect in order to improve and learn. I find that high scorers often have never had to face adversity and when told they did something wrong they fall apart. Students and residents are becoming harder and harder to train and rankings/standardized tests do nothing to distinguish these characteristics.
In response to comment above, I think DEI and representation is important. We know that for some patients having a physician who looks like them or who has some shared lived experience improves trust and improves outcomes.
Sill misses one point. Just before medical schools decided to thumb their noses at rankings, law schools had just done it. And they didn't do it because of the failure of the ranking system, but to subtract themselves from the new diversity standards.
Excellent points, Daniel. Most of the blame for the fetid state of medical schools (and I am tenured Full in one of them) lays squarely at the feet of the LCME, the accrediting body for such schools. It has changed admission requirements (for the worse), grading requirements (there aren't any, any more, largely because the admission requirements focus on SJW score, demographic score, and "distance travelled" rather than academic excellence and focus on helping every patient get better), deprecation of standardized testing (National Boards now pass/fail so they can be easily gamed) and has put in place curriculum standards that make sure that schools can NOT focus on areas of interest like some of those you mentioned.
The system is truly broken, and the rankings issue is mostly irrelevant. What is needed is a brand new, patient-care-oriented accrediting organization for medical schools. What we have now is not reparable and you will not see any changes as long as it persists. Perhaps a Florida or someone will do this properly -- we shall see.
The problem with Medical Schools is that they no longer seem to teach medical students to actually assess the patient. There is an over reliance on tests and scans rather than good physical exam technique and taking a good H&P.
I agree 100% with Dr. Belkin's response. It is not surprising that the bottom ranked schools are not the ones pulling out; this is virtue signaling without consequence. Frankly, I went to the school that 1) I could best afford and 2) admitted me. And I ended up being a physician-scientist, even though I went to medical school thinking I wanted to be a primary care doctor...so I probably should have gone to a different school. but it worked out ok.
This is all well and good. I would argue that the majority of people just are going to go where they get it. We are kidding ourselves if we think that the majority of people applying to medical schools are actually using these ranking to decide where they go because the admission process and probably geography and cost decide for them.
The biggest flaw in students and resident today is an inability to take feedback for improvement as a positive. Show me an application process that teaches resiliency and an ability to self reflect in order to improve and learn. I find that high scorers often have never had to face adversity and when told they did something wrong they fall apart. Students and residents are becoming harder and harder to train and rankings/standardized tests do nothing to distinguish these characteristics.
In response to comment above, I think DEI and representation is important. We know that for some patients having a physician who looks like them or who has some shared lived experience improves trust and improves outcomes.
This is all a cover for declining meritocracy due to DEI .
Yep, that's the point I made earlier, and that everyone in his entourage is missing.
Sill misses one point. Just before medical schools decided to thumb their noses at rankings, law schools had just done it. And they didn't do it because of the failure of the ranking system, but to subtract themselves from the new diversity standards.
Excellent points, Daniel. Most of the blame for the fetid state of medical schools (and I am tenured Full in one of them) lays squarely at the feet of the LCME, the accrediting body for such schools. It has changed admission requirements (for the worse), grading requirements (there aren't any, any more, largely because the admission requirements focus on SJW score, demographic score, and "distance travelled" rather than academic excellence and focus on helping every patient get better), deprecation of standardized testing (National Boards now pass/fail so they can be easily gamed) and has put in place curriculum standards that make sure that schools can NOT focus on areas of interest like some of those you mentioned.
The system is truly broken, and the rankings issue is mostly irrelevant. What is needed is a brand new, patient-care-oriented accrediting organization for medical schools. What we have now is not reparable and you will not see any changes as long as it persists. Perhaps a Florida or someone will do this properly -- we shall see.
The problem with Medical Schools is that they no longer seem to teach medical students to actually assess the patient. There is an over reliance on tests and scans rather than good physical exam technique and taking a good H&P.